At PAX East, we had an opportunity to take a seat down with the full of life Nico Papalia and High Hat Studios – developer of Athenian Rhapsody, and its newly-announced prequel, Tales of Tuscany (releasing on “no matter you play video games on,” together with Change, in 2026).
We needed to study a bit extra about what impressed such a mad-cap universe, and the place the WarioWare / EarthBound / Pokémon-esque concepts all stemmed from. Whereas it was a little bit of a problem to speak over the raucous laughter coming from the group gathered on the demo sales space, we managed to get an inside glimpse at Papalia’s shocking backstory and his work on each video games.
Right here is our interview with Nico, which was simply as entertaining and zany because the universe these video games are based mostly in…
Nintendo Life: So, let’s begin from the highest — what was the inspiration behind the universe of Tales of Tuscany and Athenian Rhapsody? There appear to be some Earthbound vibes in there…
Nico Papalia: Actually, I did not even play Earthbound till AFTER I began Athenian Rhapsody – enjoyable truth! I bit into it and was like, ‘I really feel like this meshes with me,’ and I felt prefer it seemed like what I used to be making. Undoubtedly impressed by Pokémon on Recreation Boy Advance, performed a variety of that. I additionally performed a variety of Fortress Crashers – The Behemoth are my buddies, so I talked to them lots, and we’re really discussing engaged on one thing collectively too — very slapstick-y, you understand — however they’re so tight about their IPs, so… we’re nonetheless speaking.
I had large concepts – however I by no means knew programming, I went to high school for artwork, I used to be doing conventional pencil artwork and stuff – I did not know what I used to be doing. So it constructed over time, and I am very lucky and fortunate that I used to be capable of share this on the scale that I did, and switch it into my job. It’s totally private.
“Slapstick-y” is certainly the appropriate phrase for these video games, they’re hilarious.
Yeah, it would not take itself too significantly, so the inspiration for the world is simply principally my life, my buddies, and what I believe is humorous in the intervening time. I am going to simply throw humorous issues in there as I consider them – and the gamers appear to find it irresistible. I am a solo dev, so I can type of have the ultimate say and simply do no matter I need. It is enjoyable. Within the first sport, I took some dangers and had this ‘invisible grilled cheese’ within the map, like an merchandise, and I believed no one was going to seek out it – however somebody discovered it inside eight hours of launch! I crashed out on social, I bugged out.
Will there be any secrets and techniques or easter eggs to seek out in Tales of Tuscany?
There aren’t too many secrets and techniques but – I am nonetheless growing it, and I simply completed the principle story, so now I’ve to do the ‘evil’ story, and I am going to type of simply throw some additional stuff in there earlier than it releases, most likely round spring 2026.
Inform us slightly extra about how the 2 video games differ.
You realize, making Athenian Rhapsody was type of gradual. I began with GameMaker, and it simply type of snowballed. So I actually did not actually know what I used to be doing, going into the primary sport. It was in 4:3 ratio, like Recreation Boy Advance – as a result of I am an enormous GBA man. So at first I used to be like, “Yeah, that is superior!” Then, you understand, it involves porting it and I am like… “Oh no.”
So, Tales of Tuscany is within the RIGHT decision. It is also received extra management customisations, quality-of-life stuff like that. Spherical 2: larger, higher, stronger. I wish to say, Athenian Rhapsody is like Pokémon Emerald, and Tales of Tuscany is extra like Pokémon Black & White – based mostly on the battles and stuff, with the digicam motion, sprite work, stuff like that.
So that you’re clearly an enormous Pokémon fan too! What are a number of the completely different video games you performed rising up?
I performed a variety of Recreation Boy Advance video games – Madagascar, Energy Rangers Dino Thunder, Minish Cap, and issues like that. My grandma would simply go purchase them for me. Or I performed Crash Bandicoot on the PS2, and I’d simply keep within the beginning space and mess with stuff – I by no means progressed within the sport, and that was really most likely what I do with most of those video games. I by no means progressed; I simply did issues. And I assume all of it type of simply fashioned that inspiration for me.
Attention-grabbing – so are you a little bit of a completionist then? As a result of this sport — with all the completely different decisions and storylines — appears a bit overwhelming for a completionist, like you could possibly by no means *really* full it solely.
You realize what, after I was an adolescent, I used to be extra of a completionist; I’d 100% full Donkey Kong: Tropical Freeze and stuff like that. However a variety of instances, I used to be simply type of a silly man who did not know what I used to be doing. I could not advance by the plots, I by no means received Rayquaza [in Pokémon Emerald] – so I’d simply go and do random issues. And now, I am really type of the alternative of that. So making Athenian Rhapsody and Tales of Tuscany, I need a child to have the ability to simply go round and have enjoyable.
The video games appear to be designed almost like a continuing dopamine hit. Gamers are allowed to only be mischievous and do no matter they need. And there is most likely no method you could possibly expertise each single alternative accessible to you within the video games.
That is precisely it! That is type of what me and my buddies like. You type of must get in there just a few instances, and the way in which it labored out, some gamers like that, and a few do not. Some individuals are that goal, numeric, “I am finished, test the field” factor – however with these video games, the expertise is all the time going to be completely different, relying on who you have got in your get together and the alternatives you make. One other factor is that, it would not really feel ‘good’, and lots of people like that.
Did you all the time intend for the sport to be a ‘choose-your-own-adventure’ type like that?
Yeah, I all the time meant for it to be like that, however I did not precisely know how you can do it at first. I could not determine it out. So, Athenian Rhapsody was not programmed very effectively… Tales of Tuscany is programmed a lot better, I used to be capable of pull it off higher. However I simply needed to begin small and construct off of it, as a result of I had large concepts – however I by no means knew programming, I went to high school for artwork, I used to be doing conventional pencil artwork and stuff, I did not know what I used to be doing. So it constructed over time, and I am very lucky and fortunate that I used to be capable of share this on the scale that I did, and switch it into my job. It’s totally private.
As somebody who studied artwork and went to high school for it, did that assist with the event of the sport itself – at the very least, the artwork side of it?
That is really a sick query – it should have! I went to SUNY Oneonta, superior college, I had a variety of nice academics. I used to be all into anatomy — transformational anatomy — and it took me type of some time to determine it out, utilizing house and character design.
So after I began Athenian Rhapsody, my pixel artwork was very poor – I did not have these fully-saturated colors but, I did not determine that out but. My sprites, I used to be doing the pillow shading… so it took me some time to get it. There’s some type of interlink, however that talent positively wasn’t fast; I needed to study to entry that a part of my mind, studying the fundamentals of pixel artwork. Even in Athenian Rhapsody, while you play it, you may see there are 10 issues happening in a single room; that is as a result of I did not know what I used to be doing with the house! That actually led to this sense of extraordinarily hyper tempo, issues round each nook…
However it works! The absurdism is what makes all of it so endearing. A part of it sounds prefer it was unintentional, trial-and-error, however that truly turned a extremely cool factor.
Precisely! And I used to be simply doing what I needed to do. I received fortunate that individuals favored it. Some folks assume it is slightly an excessive amount of, however I’ve additionally heard from a variety of gamers who actually prefer it, saying they love the story. One other publication, the reviewer mentioned he thought the story “modified vibes an excessive amount of,” and that is the place he wrote me off for factors. However I’ve received different folks — particularly youthful children, however a variety of adults, too — saying they love that in regards to the story!
And I personally assume it is very wanted. A number of instances on this business, folks can take themselves slightly too significantly, and I recognize that you simply’re simply doing what you wanna do. It looks like individuals are drawn to that.
Yeah, I attempt to get very private and present myself as I’m. That is how I constructed this, doing tutorials on-line and constructing a following simply being myself. I simply took my telephone and filmed my display screen displaying “Immediately I did this,” and I used to be simply being actual. However I am fortunate, I nonetheless simply get to do no matter I need. Like for Tales of Tuscany, the staff thought it was slightly little bit of a danger, making the principle character a sheep…
Lambypoo – it jogs my memory of my canine’s toy, Lambchop!
Oh my god, YES! That is precisely it! I’ve 100 of these laying round my home, ripped up! That is the place it got here from, I am so glad you mentioned that! So I used to be identical to… yo, what if I had a button, the place the lamb simply began “baaa”-ing? And that is the place the concept for the ‘Baa’ button got here from. You realize, it would not all the time must be this “Maintain X, cost your sword…” – you possibly can simply have enjoyable with it. So the ‘Baa’ changed into an interplay software – you possibly can break vegetation and vehicles and stuff, as a result of folks simply wanna do enjoyable stuff, just like the dopamine hits we talked about earlier. So I am attempting to hone in on that.
I am nonetheless shocked you hadn’t performed the Earthbound / Mom video games previous to beginning your first sport. It seems like such a non secular successor to these video games.
Proper? And relating to the flavour textual content in these video games, just like the choices are: “Yeah”, or “I am lactose illiberal” – that is precisely how I write, too. It virtually unlocked one thing, after I noticed that. I used to be like, ‘Okay, so that is okay what I am doing, this irreverence.’
I watched a documentary on Earthbound, and the director was saying he had a really intuitive strategy – he did not plan all of it out, he simply did it block-by-block, and that is precisely what I do, too. So I assume it is that very same mind sort, possibly? And I had buddies from my college who have been attempting to inform me: “Yeah, you must block the entire sport out” and all of these items, and I used to be like: “Dude, however I am altering it daily?”. So there are a variety of variations between the 2 video games and the way a lot I deliberate out Tales of Tuscany, however they’re the identical spirit.
Talking of Earthbound, I’ve heard you seek advice from your video games as “JRPGs” just a few instances – what does that label imply to you particularly?
Actually, I have been saying “JRPG” recently simply because I consider a long-narrative-based sport, and “RPG” is just too broad. However I do not know… I additionally name it an “IRPG” generally — “Italian RPG” — as a result of I am Italian, and Italians do like lengthy conversations.
For somebody who’s by no means heard of both of your video games, what is the one factor you’ll say to get them to try this sequence?
Out of all the RPGs and JRPGs on the market, there are lots, and a superb one that actually makes it to the end line is difficult to seek out. This sport has a variety of love in it, there’s one thing to like in it for everyone, that is an enormous a part of how I made the sport. I beloved Recreation Freak’s early philosophy of attempting to strike a stability between ‘cute’ and ‘cool’, and the way everybody has a favorite pokémon. And with Athenian Rhapsody, I attempted to make one follower that everybody might love. It is the sport that conforms to what you want, and everybody will get one thing out of it. The ‘rhapsodies’ are like Gen 1 buying and selling; I needed everybody to get one thing out of it. In Pokémon, you possibly can port your Pokémon throughout all the consoles, and that is type of what I used to be attempting to do. We’ll see how that works!
So, the ‘munchkins’ are making a comeback, too, solely this time, the weasels are watching you and ruining every part. This new characteristic appears fairly merciless, and I am questioning what occurred to you as a baby that made you need to torture folks?
HA! So, within the first sport, I had a debug possibility within the ‘pause’ menu — only a placeholder — and it was known as ‘munchkins’, and all these silly issues. And I used to be like, eff it, I am gonna make ‘munchkins’ an actual factor. So principally, you must wait, like, 8-10 hours to obtain them, and you’ve got a 50% likelihood of failing… and if it really works, it is only a image of some artwork of mine that claims like, “Congratulations” – however I did not understand everybody was going loopy over that!
So with Tales of Tuscany, I believed ‘Okay, I will not have a random 50% likelihood of failing on the finish… however there WILL be weasels… and the weasels come and slowly go throughout the display screen, and once they inform you, you must press an enter, in any other case they will corrupt the munchkin.’ I believed, ‘I can not simply do the identical factor once more’, so I modified it up slightly bit. No one else is doing munchkins! No one else is doing one thing to the participant the place they’re like, ‘No, you do it the way in which I need you to do it, or else you fail, and I am not making it simpler since you’re complaining.’
You are simply going to make the sport you need to make, and purposely reside outdoors of the field. Was there something too loopy in Tales of Tuscany that ended up getting vetoed but?
Yeah, there are some things my publishers inform me I’ve to edit… I do know extra how you can skirt the road now, however there have been just a few components that may have to vary. There’s this character from Athenian Rhapsody known as Uncle Billiard, and he is on this one once more as a result of he is a terrific character – and he has this sizzling canine place, however all of them name the recent canines ‘wieners’… and there is this one character who’s like, “Oh yeah, my double wiener sandwich…” and looking out again on it, I am like, “I can not simply be throwing ‘wiener’ round like that.” Or like, I needed to have an enemy with a plumber’s crack, and a mechanic the place you must throw issues in it. And I really vetoed that for Athenian Rhapsody, as a result of it was type of disgusting.
…Ask forgiveness, not permission?
Yep, that is my motto!
Do you have got plans so as to add any extra to this universe, or do you assume you may go in a completely completely different path?
Actually, I believe this IP was a superb one, it is robust. I did particularly need to do three RPGs.
Why three, due to Earthbound?
Oh, I did not even take into consideration that! I simply thought it could be a pleasant quantity.
You need to do three, and simply by no means launch the ultimate one right here.
HA, yeah, I am going to simply say there is a third! You realize, I did initially need to do three, however making this sport, I am nearing the tip of the inventive growth, and I type of need to take a break from RPGs for a bit. We’re doing the cell sport, too – it is known as Goobie Backyard, and Thunder Goober is in it, he clearly hit one thing, so even when I do resolve to take a break with the IP, I am going to all the time come again to it. However I believe for my subsequent console sport, I would love to do one thing slightly extra easy, mechanic-based… possibly a battler? I would love to do a roguelike sport. Unsure but although!
This interview has been calmly edited for readability.
Thanks, Nico Papalia (@AthenianRhapso1 on X) and the staff at High Hat Studios, for taking the time to reply our questions. Tales of Tuscany will likely be coming to PC and consoles in 2026.
Will you be enjoying Tales of Tuscany when it releases? Did you play Athenian Rhapsody? Tell us within the feedback beneath.